By Johnathan Paoli
Former Police Minister Bheki Cele faced another combative session before Parliament’s Ad Hoc Committee investigating corruption and political interference in the South African Police Service (SAPS) on Friday afternoon, as committee members interrogated him about his tenure, his relationships with senior officers and his past remarks about fellow police leaders.
Cele faced questions by uMkhonto weSizwe Party’s David Skosana in the latter half of the day.
Skosana began by taking issue with Cele’s earlier praise for former National Police Commissioner Jackie Selebi, disputing his claim that Selebi had completed the amalgamation of South Africa’s fragmented police forces after 1994.
“Your assertion is wrong,” Skosana insisted, arguing that George Fivaz, not Selebi, had overseen the amalgamation.
Cele countered that Fivaz had initiated but not finalised the process, which Selebi later completed.
Skosana accused Cele of publicly disparaging former commissioners, including Riah Phiyega. Cele stood by his previous criticism, saying Phiyega “messed up the police.”
When Skosana pressed Cele on whether he had regrets from his time as minister or national commissioner, Cele bluntly replied, “No.”
When asked if he had been perfect, he conceded, “No.”
The exchange grew heated when Skosana warned Cele about speaking under oath, prompting an angry retort from Cele: “Don’t threaten me about oath!”
Skosana claimed he had proof that Cele had personally appointed a divisional commissioner, contradicting Cele’s testimony that such appointments were not made by ministers.
Committee chair Soviet Lekganyane intervened, calling for calm and reminding both men that “the people of South Africa are watching.” He urged them to “tone down” and stick to questions rather than debates.
Skosana asked Cele whether he remembered visiting Mkhondo, Mpumalanga, and whether he knew a figure called “Alpha.” Cele quipped, “I know Omega,” drawing laughter in the room.
Skosana then raised concerns about members of the Investigating Directorate Against Corruption (IDAC) allegedly harassing ministers and generals.
Cele declined to answer directly but later agreed that while “rogue” elements existed in IDAC, “there are rogue people at other places too.”
The MKP MP questioned Cele about his dealings with Thulani Matlala, the controversial businessman implicated in several police-linked investigations.
Cele said he was “comfortable and interested” when Matlala first approached him because his own name had come up in the conversation.
African National Congress (ANC) MP Mdumiseni Ntuli then took over questioning, focusing on Cele’s past comments about former Crime Intelligence head Richard Mdluli, whom Cele described as “not a very kind guy” and “a person that people were scared of.”
Cele said Mdluli was appointed by a ministerial panel before his own term as national commissioner and later suspended for eight years while continuing to draw a salary.
Ntuli probed whether Cele’s relationship with Mdluli may have created political enemies: “including the head of state at the time,” referring to former President Jacob Zuma.
Cele suggested that infiltration of state security structures by various interests was widespread: “From the security world, there are no structures that are not infiltrated by opposition.”
Ntuli also questioned Cele about the Political Killings Task Team (PKTT), its costs, and possible financial abuses.
Cele said there were reports of police staying in “posh hotels” such as the Oyster Box, adding: “For me, there would be no reason for the police to be sent to sleep there.”
Cele went on to criticise South Africa’s bail and parole system, saying repeat offending was rampant, and corruption undermined justice.
“We’ve created a system where victims are treated worse than perpetrators,” he said.
Ntuli asked about the appointment process for Cele’s chief of staff, to which Cele explained that the minister had “a very big say” though appointments were recommended by a panel.
The discussion turned to private investigator Paul O’Sullivan, whom Cele described as “like an octopus” and “a shady kind of human being.”
Cele claimed O’Sullivan “hates Khumalo, Masemola, Mkhwanazi, and Cele” but “has no problem with Mchunu.”
Cele reiterated that allegations made by Matlala could be “50/50” truth or fabrication but said he believed them at the time because they came from “security circles.”
Evidence leader Norman Arendse questioned Cele about alleged interference in investigations and whether he ever engaged with the National Prosecuting Authority (NPA) on specific cases.
He said his presence at crime scenes was driven by community expectations, not interference.
Arendse also raised concerns about IDAC’s oversight, noting parallels with Cele’s testimony that unlike IPID or the Hawks, IDAC lacked external accountability.
Concluding the session, Arendse said Cele was the first witness interviewed in the committee’s inquiry.
Lekganyane announced that proceedings would resume on Tuesday
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